From today’s Associated Press: `
Spider-Man 3' Nets Record $59M in 1 Day
Saturday May 5 12:19 PM ET
"Hollywood's biggest superhero now has the biggest box-office debut. "Spider-Man 3" took in a record $59 million domestically on opening day Friday, breaking the previous all-time high of $55.8 million for "Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest" in its first day last summer.”
I haven’t seen the film yet. My wife took our eight year-old son last night His feeling is that, on the scale of important events in his so-far brief life, seeing this film first night eclipsed his actual birth. I didn’t join them because I was busy with work, and the following synopsis at Yahoo Movies aroused the Paul Mooney in me:
http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1808496334/details
“Peter Parker has finally managed to strike a balance between his devotion to M.J. and his duties as a superhero. But there is a storm brewing on the horizon. When his suit suddenly changes, turning jet-black and enhancing his powers, it transforms Peter as well, bringing out the dark, vengeful side of his personality that he is struggling to control. Under the influence of the suit, Peter becomes overconfident and starts to neglect the people who care for him most.”
Now, I’m not one of those “everything in life is racial – even spaghetti” types, but why even evil Spiderman gotta be Black?
----- EXTENDED BODY: ----- EXCERPT: ----- KEYWORDS: ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/05/2007 06:45:30 PM no hidden racism here.., Venom (the black suit) is an alien symbiont. It's part of a larger story cycle that began in 1988. Not to get all fanboy on you or anything, but when the Marvel writers did their most awkward treatment of Black folks, it had a decidedly different flavor than what you see with a complex storyline featuring an ominously Black (like Black Widow spider) parasitic costume. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/05/2007 06:50:21 PM Here's a clever take on Marvel's racial stumbling and bumbling ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.139.154 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/05/2007 06:52:05 PM Hey Bill. Since folks here have NO idea how the Hip Hop industry really works, why don't you do a little post about how you see the diffence between the industry now and how it was on Elizabeth Street in, let's say, 1986-87? Later, Michael ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 07:26:53 PM Bill, Please provide the disclaimer you didn't know spiderman went to an alternate universe to battle other superheroes and returned with the black matter. Most people who have comic book history know this. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: bigmaconcampus EMAIL: IP: 69.86.156.240 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 07:34:10 PM also, what's up with all these racist kids who are "afraid of the DARK." ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: keto EMAIL: IP: 71.59.142.147 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 09:18:44 PM The costume's color has nothing to do with race. Let's save this type of issue for the AOL Black Voices forum, next to the discussion on R. Kelly's love child. To use cnulan's words: "If you've read anything .. "insulting" between the lines, well..., that's between you and the voices in your head brah..," ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: rikyrah EMAIL: siport27@aol.com IP: 172.133.89.140 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 09:20:31 PM it was meteor ooze. Maybe they could have used something other than Black, but what color then? Couldn't use green, because they'd be accused of ripping off Superman and Kryptonite. Blue? Would you really think that Blue would denote a sad change in Spidey? White? The costume would get dirty. Yello? Who'd be scared of a spiderman in a yellow costume? Brown? Pink? Purple? I'm usually feeling folks, but this conversation is going the way of Tom Joyner and J.Anthony Brown about ' hidden racism' (cue the echo sound). ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: rikyrah EMAIL: siport27@aol.com IP: 172.133.89.140 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 09:26:27 PM I did see the movie, and while it wasn't as good as Spidey 2, very few movies could be as good as Spidey 2. For a self-avowed movie fanatic, it was just the right beginning to the Summer Movie Season. Considering the misery that was last summer, looking at the schedule, I think I'll be in the movie theater 3 out of every 4 weekends from now until Labor Day....and, that makes me a happy camper..LOL ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: M. EMAIL: IP: 69.251.184.57 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 10:44:35 PM I think the problem goes further back -- by about 400+ years. By referring to Africans as black instead of brown and Europeans as white instead of yellow, Europeans constructed races within the pre-existing good/evil Christian symbolic dichotomy. As far as Spiderman 3 is concerned, I'd also like to add that it's horribly predictable in the dull, Joseph Campbell sorta way. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: assaultonblacksanity@gmail.com IP: 166.214.139.154 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/06/2007 04:54:42 AM Bill: Chuck recently said the following on his blog, publicenemy.com: THE BUZZARDS OF BUSINESS On the contrary the news reports of Lyor Cohen and Russell Simmons trying to gather the hip hop current bangers for fixing hip hop's flat tire in the light of anus, remarks - is like what? You go figure. These two, I've known, have always followed the dollar and this time the desperation could be off the fact the available dollar is no longer there for the recording business as it was. Gone. And Russell and Lyor gutted and cashed out their assets long ago. Now they wanna put out a bonfire with a watergun. Sht, gimme a break. Buzzards. A buzzard is not a bad bird they just capitalize on the dead. If NAS says hip hop is dead, remember it can still thrive in a zombie state and spread dead spirit like Rap of the Living Death. TUPAC and BIGGIE get killed and like a buzzard, 1998 replaces the image with DEF JAM icons DMX= PAC, JAY Z= B.I.G. = Brooklyn's best. Again being a buzzard is not always a bad thing, they just wait for the smoke to clear and scoop the death into a business. As far as life (and a woman is life itself, which explains the lack of a woman's voice and brain in hip hop ... again = death) Again a buzzards attitude can be glued to your average hustler, dealer, pimp agenda. By any means necessary life for a few at the expense of death for many. Can't ask a buzzard to save a life. Given that you were both, a pivotal component of PE's development, and at the true hey-day of Def Jam, Def Jam's Vice-President of marketing and Promotion, what's your take on the matter? take care, Michael ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Chauncey EMAIL: IP: 169.230.100.245 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 06:13:02 AM similarly, why does night have to be black? seriously, what's that about? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 07:47:37 AM Michael Fisher, You are the baddest brother in the blogosphere and no one even come close. Keep up the good work and just be you. So what's up Bill, no comment? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Joan Steptoe EMAIL: IP: 151.196.233.56 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 10:42:28 AM Well, hopefully, one of issues that the moderators of blackprof.com invited Mr. Stephney to discuss is hip hop --its contents and discontents. In Mr. Stephney's defense (and he certainly doesn't need it): many of us work for institutions that are problematic either at their core or in their effects. It is ignorant when the media (or us) assumes that one black person represents all black folks. Likewise, it is ignorant when we assume that one employee--however highly placed--represents all people within an organization. With that said, I still do hope that Mr. Stephney posts a response to Michael Fischer's question and engages the problems of hip hop's depictions from his insider's point of view. Mr. Stephney: the blackprof.com community needs to learn from your understanding of hip hop and not just your fun-spirited view of Spider Man. So I am looking forward to a substantive commentary on hip hop from you and I wish you best wishes. ~Joan ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.195.240 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/06/2007 11:12:05 AM "Likewise, it is ignorant when we assume that one employee--however highly placed--represents all people within an organization." Dear Ms. Steptoe. Not to step ony your toe, but that "ignorant" statment is just ... In any case, Bill and I have known each other and been colleagues in the Hip Hop industry for some twenty years. Thus, being a bit knowledgable about the "people and organization" myself, I know that Bill is quite qualified to answer these questions. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: setting the record straight EMAIL: IP: 70.124.86.36 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 02:22:09 PM Black has always been the color which denoted evil throughout human history. It was only in recent times that black America demanded to be called "black." Can't we find something more legitimate to lament? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: gt EMAIL: IP: 74.98.254.227 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 02:55:02 PM i think there was a very clear racialized theme to spiderman 3. not only does the black suit bring out his macho, aggressive side, but it gets him strutting (like, really strutting...or white man strutting anyway) about town with some funk-like tunes playing in the background (alluding perhaps to a cultural turn to blackness as well). ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.99.21 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 03:30:14 PM My rage over the portrayal of our people as "VENOMS" is intensifying... Think clearly people: Spiderman = White and Good Venom = Black and Evil Venom = Poison Poison = Black Folks Please believe the algebra here...in fact, due to my builiding personal anger over this cinematic insult, in subsequent posts, I shall refer to this reprehensible character only as: ...the "V-WORD." ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.99.21 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 03:35:05 PM Mike Fisher, Hello, old friend. Good to see you amongst people of intellect here. Have no fear - I'll chime in on the Artistry Formerly Known As Hip Hop in a minute. How is our old chum, Roy, the Black Prince? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.99.21 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 03:45:47 PM Keto said: "The costume's color has nothing to do with race. Let's save this type of issue for the AOL Black Voices forum, next to the discussion on R. Kelly's love child." I say: Fine, so I guess we won't see you at the "Marvel Comics March for Dignity" I'm organizing - I'll leave you off of the e-mail blast update list. Further, please leave Black Voices alone. Where else can significant numbers of adults engage in extensive critical discourse about the merits of Beyonce's lacefronts... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: drsnacks EMAIL: IP: 141.156.239.126 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 10:01:57 PM R Kelly has a love child!? By who? It's Beyonce, isn't it? Where's the Black Voices forum, now? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.33.162 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/07/2007 04:26:11 AM "How is our old chum, Roy, the Black Prince?" Roy Cormier with the coconut lotion? He's fine. Taking care of his child, bought a few apartment buildings and fast food franchises. The things you can do with Hip Hop money... when you're a black man. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 68.106.98.16 URL: http://pmsol3.wordpress.com DATE: 05/07/2007 06:34:57 AM this entire post is nonsense. Cnulan was right, anyone who read comics at the time (which I did) know the Venom story from the Secret Wars Marvel Comic Story Arc. It has nothing to do with race. When Marvel wanted to exploit black characters in the 70's (Blade, Cage, etc) it was totally different. Black did not all the sudden become associated with negative or evil in 1988 or 2007, this has been a common theme in Europe and Asian for thousands of years. Get over it. On a site called "Black Prof" I would expect a more nuanced argument than knee jerk reactionary rhetoric that I could find in the hood in front of the liquor store. Don't black people have any bigger problems in America than what color Spider Man's suit is? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.105.25 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 10:14:07 AM Dragon Horse says: "Don't black people have any bigger problems in America than what color Spider Man's suit is?" I say: Of course we do. But when has proper prioritization of meaningful objectives ever stopped us before? This film is going to earn $1 billion dollars worldwide. I won't rest until every projectionist showing the film is fired by Loews, AMC, Clearview and Sony immediately. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: mister EMAIL: IP: 217.225.115.66 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 10:26:29 AM PUUULEAZE MISTER AUTHOR, U CANT BE SERIOUS!?!? Now, I’m not one of those “everything in life is racial – even spaghetti” types, but - ok, stop right there then. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 162.6.224.224 URL: http://pmsol3.wordpress.com DATE: 05/07/2007 11:19:59 AM "This film is going to earn $1 billion dollars worldwide. I won't rest until every projectionist showing the film is fired by Loews, AMC, Clearview and Sony immediately." Okay now you must be joking. LOL ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 208.27.111.125 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 02:30:28 PM the real question is: why do people call african americans "black" in the first place? I have never seen "black" person (or a "white" person, for that matter) --- only brown and dark brown people. Spider Man (in part 3) is black --- I mean he's really the color black, African Americans are not. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Mike Bobbitt EMAIL: EMBOBBITT@aol.com IP: 24.46.252.47 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 02:55:29 PM Dear Mr Stephney: I take your post as I think it's intended: with a bit of humor and an underlying bit of truth. As a Marvel comics fan, I wondered why they even tapped into the Secret Wars' story line for these Spiderman movies that are clearly set squarely in New York City, but here we are. I have wondered if the initial notion for the movie makers was as simple as (a) black costumes look cool, and (b) the Venom story line sold a lot of comics - now lets sell those tickets! Since "green" so often trumps considerations of black and white, right? For further reflection I think one should go back to the comics that provided the source material. Now, I've never been attacked by an alien symbiote (to my knowledge) so I don't know why one couldn't appear to be some shade of brown, etc. Why black in the first place? Maybe they tried to explain this in Secret Wars but I am going to take a pass on digging through my collection, and just finish writing this post (so excuse me if I err.) When the Secret Wars issues came out I assumed to some degree this was concocted as a clever way to put Spidey in a black costume. And strange though it is, I agree that it is easier to tell comic fans their hero is hosting an alien lifeform than that he just had a burst of inspiration to change up his costume. (Side note - I think they dreamed up the Scarlet Spider, and the Spiderman 2099 (and other 2099)comics for the same chief reason - just to sell us more stuff). Simple. So I wouldn't be surprised if this wasn't the same motivation Sam Raimi et al had. Still, the question: why black? It may well be that the writers and artists who created the Spidey & symbiote storyline had bought into (consciously or not) certain black = evil, hpyer macho, violent, etc. stereotypes. I wonder if they would join this or another online discussion? Anyway, the movie makers could easily wriggle out of this conversation at this stage by saying they just inherited these interpretations (they'd never take it as a given I don't think) along with the characters and the initial situations from Marvel. Plus I can imagine the uproar from Marvel fans if they changed the color of the suite, regardless of their motivation for doing so. So where does that leave us? Perhaps with an argument that even while warranting our consideration, is too nuanced to serve as an effective example for many folks. A more direct (I don't know how to measure how useful) example was in Spike Lee's "Malcolm X": we see Malcolm read the dictionary definitions given to "white" and "black" - then watch what the real-life hero does with that and other information. I would like to point out another aspect of these movies that's been bugging me a bit: the regular unmasking of Spiderman. This is supposed to be a guy who wants a secret identity but (a) all the people on the train in the second movie have seen his face and now (b) everyone who has seen footage of him getting the key to city hall has seen part of his face. Basically everyone knows Spiderman is a young white guy. Reading the comics only WE knew that - and only because WE knew his secret identity. No one else knew that (with periodic, strategic exceptions). I thought that was one part of his appeal - he was a hero who could represent anybody and so did represent everybody. I find this casual approach to revealing his face to be a bit of a disappointment. It makes Spiderman seem less universal in his appeal as a hero, to me. Instead we have a white hero, white damsel, white friends, white petty thugs (thank heavens they didn't update Uncle Ben's killer by making him black) and white super villains. I suppose we should feel lucky Robbie Roberson still works at the Daily Bugle (in fairness, there are black cub scouts during the city hall ceremony too). Anyway this context (where it's a given the characters that matter are white) probably makes the introduction of the first major character who "happens to be black" being a creepy alien parasitic ooze rather than oh, say, a motivated black human being, seem more problematic than might otherwise be the case. On another tangent, is anyone else tired of waiting (about 20 years now I think?) for a Luke Care "Hero For Hire" movie to finally get made? The lengths we go to for our black superheroes... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Guess EMAIL: jthompson25@sbcglobal.net IP: 70.130.170.0 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 03:15:02 PM Victory is not defined in terms of blackness, but whiteness. Strength is not defined in terms of blackness, but whiteness. Protection is not defined in terms of blackness, but whiteness. And I would argue that all white people are white because they have defined themselves on what they consider to be the negatives of being black. This is always "acted out" in all of white man's films and his stories of manhood and strength. Blackness continues to be defined as something dark, dangerous, and ugly...and in this instance it seems to rise to the occassion. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: 9jah EMAIL: IP: 38.119.129.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 03:15:37 PM Black Prof: Please screen your commentators. Such nonsensical drivel only serves to undermine the importance and relevance of this forum. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 162.6.224.224 URL: http://pmsol3.wordpress.com DATE: 05/07/2007 04:25:11 PM So was the red costume against Native AMericans? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.33.162 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/07/2007 04:39:31 PM Folks. Apparently many don't quite understand where Bill is coming from, because you have not worked in the image creation and sales industry. Bill has, and so have I. Now, ther is nary a poster here who has not been affected, one way or the other, by Public Enemy. Why is that? Public Enemy is an image. It was created with great deliberation. Bill helped create it. After studying the use of image, color, sound, and text, context in the entertainment industry they created Pubic Enemy. He also was the main person marketing the image. And made a contribution to a mental sea-change not onlu among black youth, but also among white and other non-black youth world-wide. So why would he not be able to take on Loews? Ya'll need to stop underestimating black people. White folks with power certainly don't. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 166.214.33.162 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 04:42:58 PM Folks. Apparently many don't quite understand where Bill is coming from, because you have not worked in the image creation and sales industry. Bill has, and so have I. Now, ther is nary a poster here who has not been affected, one way or the other, by Public Enemy. Why is that? Public Enemy is an image. It was created with great deliberation. Bill helped create it. After studying the use of image, color, sound, and text, context in the entertainment industry they created Public Enemy. He also was the main person marketing the image. And made a contribution to a mental sea-change not only among black youth, but also among white and other non-black youth world-wide. So why would he not be able to take on Loews? Ya'll need to stop underestimating black people. White folks with power certainly don't. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 141.150.139.18 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 05:36:33 PM Dragon Horse says: "Okay now you must be joking. LOL" I say: Indeed I am...but underneath the satire exists a definite commentary on the current politics of "collective insult reaction"... Anyway, what would you expect from a guy who's worked with Paul Mooney AND Chris Rock? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.33.162 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/07/2007 07:41:47 PM "Anyway, what would you expect from a guy who's worked with Paul Mooney AND Chris Rock?" DH. Now what the hell is your problem with Paul Mooney and Chris Rock? Your gonna have to include me in that indictment, cause my team (the afore mentioned Black Prince) was the one that produced Chris' first album. Heck I WISH I could've worked with Mooney. So go ahead, take your best shot. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 75.202.99.143 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/07/2007 10:02:44 PM "Anyway, what would you expect from a guy who's worked with Paul Mooney AND Chris Rock?" Ooops. That was YOU Bill. I guess I'm a bit tired today. Lack of sleep = lack of concentration. Sorry. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Lana EMAIL: lana@none.org IP: 162.84.180.225 URL: http://afromerica.com DATE: 05/08/2007 03:19:46 AM Here is an interesting take on this tale. http://afromerica.com/knowledge/entertainment/hollywood/spiderman3.php ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 162.6.234.178 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 08:41:43 AM "Cosby sees that culture can matter more than economics and racism, even for black people (i.e. descendants of African slaves). Dyson, typically of black academics, sees it as an urgent wisdom that black problems are all due to racism and the economy -- i.e. that they are "structural" as academics put it. Academics see Cosby's message as precisely what they have devoted their careers to teaching the public out of. However, the truth is that black America's problems are partly structural and partly cultural -- and furthermore, the cultural part is not something marginal that does not bear extended discussion. Academics will continue to be appalled at the public airing of that message -- but that's the way it has to be because, in my opinion, the academics on this question are wrong (my latest book explains why, for the record)." — John McWhorter, moderate-liberal commentator and former linguistics professor ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Debb S EMAIL: dstephney@gmail.com IP: 208.50.121.2 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 08:45:08 AM As I awakened from the "black out" I was in after receiving this "black eye" from sliding on "black ice", I realized that this "black-hearted" guy did not inform me of the "blackout". He was too busy trying to sell his "black market" DVD's. I guess that's why he's considered the "Black Sheep" of his family. I thought about "blackmailing" him but decided against it. Instead, I "blacklisted" him! Suffice it to say, I wasn't able to catch the evil Spidey, however, I am familiar with the character from the cartoon. Bill, knowing your sense of humor, which you usually combine with intellect, I got it! Excellent as always! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Debb S EMAIL: IP: 208.50.121.2 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 08:54:44 AM Bill, I wouldn't even bother to respond to someone who isn't confindent enough in himself to post his name. One who claims to be "anonymous" should remain just that. Consider him the "Invisible Spidey"! This is obviously turning into the "Haters" Board. That was straight from Black Voices as well. Moving right along..... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Debb S EMAIL: IP: 208.50.121.2 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 09:12:09 AM Ok, I see the name of each poster appears in an odd fashion. Oh Webmaster? The gray lines that separate each post includes what one would think is the poster's name. So Bill, I was actually going off on you! lol! Sorry Anon, but you really should post your name. Now that I'm in sync with the Board, I see you have good things to say. Anyway, Webmaster the page format should be changed :-) ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.169.90 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 10:06:57 AM Debb S said: "Bill, knowing your sense of humor, which you usually combine with intellect, I got it! Excellent as always!" I say: Thank you so much, Debb S...my fan club has ARRIVED!!!! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Bill Stephney EMAIL: IP: 138.89.169.90 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 10:20:55 AM Lana: Thanks for the link. The author essentially engages in a more sober presentation of my own "tongue-in-cheek" Spiderman racial rant. Let's hope "Venom" doesn't morph into the insult protest of the week. Next thing you know, there will be proposals "to foster dialogue between African-Americans and the Arachnid-American community"... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 68.106.98.16 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 11:10:13 PM Paris Hilton calls people n1ggers and f@ggots on tape: http://www.emailthis.clickability.com/et/emailThis?clickMap=viewThis&etMailToID=1997522690 also on cnn.com video news section. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 162.6.228.2 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 10:20:28 AM Cob does it again: http://cobb.typepad.com/cobb/2007/05/the_problem_wit.html OP-ED: The Problem With Institutional Racism The moderate-conservative Republican blogger writes: "One of the classic debates within black politics is the debate over the effect of institutional racism over the prospects for African American success. Something very interesting occured to me as I was reading Booker Rising's account of John McWhorter today. That is that the politics of anti-racism engaged by Leftists encourage the culture of dysfunction by blackfolks below the middle class baseline.....Part of the failure of progressive black politics is that they encourage people who can't even hack the middle class basics to believe they can beat the system via some Black Power. It never worked, it never will work. NOI is proof. Upon reaching the mainstream, that's when boldness and vision can work, but only based upon honest and open business dealings and relationships." He continues: "Academics like [Michael Eric] Dyson, coming as they do from Socialist backgrounds, believe they can identify a structural racism *that can be structurally defeated* through the defunding of 'racist institutions'. But America is not undergirded by racist institutions, America is chock full of public institutions and market institutions that are corrupted and abused by individual racists. Every racist act perpetrated by racist individuals empowered by an institution do not prove that institution racist. It only proves that America is full of racists that we are unable to keep out of the mainstream. It is the unwillingness of Leftists to acknowledge that fact that keeps many blacks distrustful of the mainstream public and market institutions into which they must integrate and assimilate in order to make the American middle class baseline. Instead, they irrationally hate and fear the very institutions upon which their improvement depends." And more: "I think instead we can say that the elimination of Jim Crow was the penultimate battle with the final battle played on social grounds - getting our entire culture past the interpersonal barriers of a Jim Crow society. The first priority of White Supremacy has always been to deny others any 'defiling' of the 'pure' white race. That's not a problem any longer. Opposition to Affirmative Action comes almost exclusively from the moral injunction against racial preferences. There can be no doubt that there are plenty of racists who can't stand the idea of race mixing on college campuses as the basis of their opposition, good luck trying to get them to say so in public. They cannot because the American mainstream doesn't tolerate such ideas. Not even when they're implied in disrespectful commentary. Virtually nobody stands on the principle of racial segregation. So where are the racist institutions? Maybe they're all in our heads." ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nana EMAIL: IP: 71.249.189.209 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 11:58:28 AM Anonymous would you explain this for me given what you just wrote. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/08/us/08deseg.html?em&ex=1178856000&en=9e7df2c20ba7531a&ei=5070 I agree that Left has problems, but no Institutional Racism. The mere fact that many of us must push ourselves into the middle class, is where we meet the problems, Mr Cobb says is hyped. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 162.6.228.2 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 01:33:44 PM Nana: negros want to keep a black man on the plantation even if it not in their children's best interest. As you noticed the issue is black people are against a black "public figure" who whites support. Whites are concerned about the children in the schools, blacks are concerned with other issues... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 134.60.11.31 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 01:40:33 PM My little voice struggles to be heard. Who told you that you are black? I am galled that americans of african descent have accepted this categorization that started from racist anthropologists and pseudo-scientists in 18, 19 th and early 20century. The only way out to remove the power that this word and other words hold on us... Why can't spiderman have a black suit... for whatever reason humanity has associated the black colour with evil, I have not explanation for it. But we have to stop being so easily offended otherwise the whole world will have a very powerful hold on our psyche. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Majora EMAIL: IP: 207.200.116.196 URL: DATE: 05/21/2007 07:15:03 PM I sincerely hope the goal of this piece was to produce satire. For the record, I didn't view the movie, however when the world of art and social commentary collide, everything is open to interpretation, even the trivial politicizing of the color of a fictional superhero's costume. I understand your effort and sometimes when the frontal brain lobes aren't analytically stimulated, it creates its own stimulation in context to whatever forum is readily available. Hence, the dissection of the Black spidey costume and it's symbolic application. Just the other day I pondered whether the "Smurfs" (cartoon) promoted anti-semetic propaganda by animating the antagonist as a person who seemed to be of Jewish descent and giving him a docile, yet bumbling cat name Azrael very similar to the word Israel. But I digress.... Anyone can pontificate upon the parallelisms of the greater society at large against art (even bad art), and with little effort there will more than likely be multiple, clear cut similarities. However in this case, unless Black Spidey suffered continuous villication, and obstruction from resources and opportunities, along with constant haranguing from media outlets wanting to portray him as a low level individual whose primary function is to engage in random sex, wear gaudy attire, and objectify women, chicken and flashy jewelry, a la Flava Flav et. al, then put your spidey senses to rest and save them for a real struggle. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Anonymous EMAIL: IP: 207.200.116.196 URL: DATE: 05/21/2007 07:21:11 PM Next thing you know, there will be proposals "to foster dialogue between African-Americans and the Arachnid-American community ^^^^^^^^^Hilarious Lana! Keep it up Spidey Noir, you will find yourself suffering the same fate as Imus. ----- -------- AUTHOR: pbutler TITLE: Al Sharpton's Campaign Against Sexism...in Hip-Hop STATUS: Publish ALLOW COMMENTS: 1 CONVERT BREAKS: tinymce ALLOW PINGS: 1 DATE: 05/04/2007 08:16:45 PM ----- BODY:
I was interviewed tonight on Fox News Network The O’Reilly Factor regarding Rev. Al Sharpton’s campaign against hip-hop. The Reverend sponsored a march yesterday in support of banning three words - a focus I describe here and here as short sighted.
I think Sharpton has done lots of good for the African-American community but I don’t understand why he is so hung up on hip-hop. If Rev. Al is concerned about cultural institutions that don’t seem to exhibit a whole lot of respect for black women, maybe he could spend time on....I dunno, the black church? As Michael Eric Dyson has pointed out, pastors don’t call black women bitches and ho’s, but many sure treat them that way. Or maybe Sharpton could sponsor a march for the inclusion of black women among ...black political leadership? Maybe every time he or Jesse Jackson get a call to go on tv, they could decline and recommend in their place an African-American woman?
What the hysteria about snitching and hip-hop have in common is people blaming African-American men for much larger cultural problems. It reminds me of a poem by Ntozake Shange that begins "the suspect is always black and in his early 20's."
----- EXTENDED BODY: ----- EXCERPT: ----- KEYWORDS: ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: keto EMAIL: IP: 15.251.169.70 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 09:33:42 PM Aside from Sharptons flaws, why not go after bad forms of hip hop? Where do our youth get influenced more, church or the music charts? We should be trying to instill the right values in our youth. I fear that gangsta and booty rap comprise too much of their thoughts, if they consume it as much as I did Public Enemy, Guru and X-Klan back in the day. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 69.156.100.76 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 09:41:41 PM Paul Butler, I consider you an enemy of black people. Sometimes African-American men do deserve the blame. Why don't you retire from public life? You are a disgrace to African American intellectuals. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: spike the cat EMAIL: IP: 81.208.36.89 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 10:27:16 PM I agree with Keto. Why not go after bad hip-hop? I would like more dialogue too, about why we American consumers seem to really gravitate toward violence and sexual degredation in mainstream outlets like music, videogames, etc. The top 40 genre seems to be disproportionately vulgar and agressive, and I am not understanding what the cultural payoff is for this type of expression. I mean at first I suppose there was the shock value of it all, a new way to say something old...But now? I don't get it. And frankly, with Akon running loose, somebody needs to speak up. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 10:51:49 PM Al Sharpton understand that corporate hip-hop is the poison needle into the veins of our Black youth. Corporate hip-hop sends negative messages to the Black youth as propaganda warfare - stop snitching, black women are sex objects, be a thug to have credibility - this is what corporate hip-hop mandated and promoting to our youth as a business. What I find wrong with Al Sharpton strategy is his failure to stop the White media from shaping his argument. Al Sharpton of all people should know the mass media will try to twist his point and he need to be more on point. For example, it was not about Don Imus - it was about the media executives. And in this fashion, it is not about some rappers, it is about the White executives that promote these negative stereotypes about our Black youth to a worldwide culture. Al Sharpton is failing to shape the message to target those who matter. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: curious EMAIL: IP: 72.76.3.157 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:38:32 PM Mr. Sharpton & Mr. Butler, two charlatans in a pod. p.s. remind is a transitive verb. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: elvina EMAIL: IP: 66.167.67.43 URL: http://imusshow.net DATE: 05/04/2007 11:39:09 PM Thank you, Professor! Saw you tonight with Michelle Malkin - hmmm - wasn't she staunchly anti-censorship when she recently covered the Danish cartoon controversy? Free speech forever - no matter how disgusting, sexist, racist, etc - for rappers, Imus, Al Sharpton, and everyone - see Imusshow.net - We don't need the media, corporate sponsors, or government telling us what we can say and hear - Let's deal with the pain, hurt, shame from slavery and racism. Strive for racial reconciliation, respect and synergy - Let's strive for civility not censorship - We don't want to live like they do in Cuba where people have to wait til it's dark out in the evening/night so they can sneak out and talk to their neighbors - Free speech - individual responsibility - no corporate conformity! Love one another - ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: elvina EMAIL: IP: 66.167.67.43 URL: http://www.imusshow.net DATE: 05/04/2007 11:42:01 PM Thank you, Professor! Saw you tonight with Michelle Malkin - hmmm - wasn't she staunchly anti-censorship when she recently covered the Danish cartoon controversy? Free speech forever - no matter how disgusting, sexist, racist, etc - for rappers, Imus, Al Sharpton, and everyone - see Imusshow.net - We don't need the media, corporate sponsors, or government telling us what we can say and hear - Let's deal with the pain, hurt, shame from slavery and racism. Strive for racial reconciliation, respect and synergy - Let's strive for civility not censorship - We don't want to live like they do in Cuba where people have to wait til it's dark out in the evening/night so they can sneak out and talk to their neighbors - Free speech - individual responsibility - no corporate conformity! Love one another - ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Chauncey EMAIL: IP: 169.230.100.245 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 12:33:34 AM black churches are directly responsible for a whole lot of good in the black community. indeed i'd say they're the only source of good in the black community today, what with the pernicious influence of black athletes, absentee fathers, hip hop gangsters and politicians (i.e., black men). that people like paul butler would attack black churches instead of hip hop, then, really goes to show you how perversely misguided "black intellectuals" are. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: spike the cat EMAIL: IP: 81.208.36.89 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 06:43:38 AM Elvina, Thanks for the link. Interesting, but I must say that as seductive as the beat and his voice are, yawn, I all hear is more b8tch this, ni88a that, blah blah blah. I googled this artist and you are right, he should have the right to saw what he wants how he wants (at least message is somewhat political) but, in the end, I alway follow the dollar signs. After all if his message is sooo important, he can give it away for free right? Just like he says, he doesn't need the corporate sponsor. Free speech doesn't gaurantee a paycheck! Likewise, Imus can upload podcasts on his own blog and talk about hoes all day long. No one is stopping him. On the cartoons: I don't recall Danish cartoons being published because corporations were following the buck. In fact, in the fallout, there were boycotts and loss of life and limb along with a great deal of very public debate. And even despite this, other country's papers published the toons as well in solidarity and others like the BBC chose not to. But back to music, people also have a right criticize it, not buy it, not support companies that produce it, not to be bombarded with it, to counteract it--all day and all night if we like, until blue in the face. I lean toward anti-censorship for the simple fact that it's better to know what the fools are saying and thinking than not. These people are seducing young minds and changing cultural behavior...Hell yeah, I want to know. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 09:17:46 AM elvina, glad to see you are real to real hip-hop artist like Immortal Technique and not like these other cornball claiming to be down with real hip hop but repeat cliche artist like Common, Mos Def, Talib whatever.. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dorkus EMAIL: IP: 66.91.246.41 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 10:33:27 AM Paul Butler, with the hideous filth you spread, I pray for your soul. Black Churches: Where secular mentoring and conventional social services programs for poor urban youth typically end, churches and religious outreach ministries often begin, especially in predominantly black communities. The black church has a unique and uniquely powerful youth and community outreach tradition. Indeed, the black church’s historic role in providing blacks with education, social services, and a safe gathering place prefigured its historic role in the civil rights movement. Ludacris: Hit it a hour and a half, watch the spectacular splash on the back and leave it drippin down the crack of her ass Call me Mr. Magillicuddy, chasin booty soft as silly puddy Killin for money, still a thug get bump; from some pokin --------- I don't know what Paul Butler is working for if it isn't pure evil. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 64.229.193.162 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 10:55:55 AM Butler doesn't care about black people. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dorkus EMAIL: IP: 66.91.246.41 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 11:06:20 AM Anon, It goes much, much further than that. Paul Butler's hideous philosophies are a devil's brew of all manner of evil. It hardly matters what color your skin is when you read what he writes as he tries to convince you that virtue is vice and vice is virtue. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Michael Fisher EMAIL: IP: 166.214.52.78 URL: http://assaultonblacksanity.blogspot.com DATE: 05/05/2007 11:20:55 AM Ya'll are tripping... An "enemy of the people?". Nonetheless. Sharpton criticising Hip Hop on Monday and hanging out with Puff and Russell in the Hamptons on Saturday and "Master Prophet" "Bishop" E. Bernard "Buy my anointed soap" Jordan on Sundays. This whole "ban" the three words thing is just to detract from the real issues. The BEHAVIOR advocated in gangsta rap. So now, a brotha can be killed in such a video but doesn't have to be worried beung called N***a in the process. A sister can be a prostitue without being called a Ho. Lovely. We sure are some dumb "Non-N***az" By the way, when is Steph finally going to do a post. I'd LOVE to see what he has to say about this stuff. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dorkus EMAIL: IP: 66.91.246.41 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 11:47:12 AM Mike, Any step in the right direction can be criticized in some way. When you attack good behavior and equate it with bad, you remove part of the motivation for good behavior. Yes, banning words is a small step, perhaps a trivial one. However, I ask you, how have you advanced the greater good by criticizing it? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Yahoo EMAIL: IP: 72.204.35.102 URL: DATE: 05/05/2007 12:31:52 PM I agree with Michael Fisher this time. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: The Angry Independent EMAIL: Websteru2006@yahoo.com IP: 75.132.119.88 URL: http://mirroronamerica.blogspot.com/ DATE: 05/06/2007 03:19:29 AM #1. Paul Butler is another apologist and sympathizer for thug rap. These "intellectuals" are dangerous because they bring legitimacy to this poison with their credentials. Butler is in the same group with Black "intellecuals" like Todd Boyd and Michael Eric Dyson... they go around the country and make excuses for the degradation and mental genocide of our people. Paul Butler is exactly the kind of guest that Faux News wants on their network for this topic. I don't know how anyone (especially a Black educator) could make excuses for this sickness. I suggest giving an ear to opposing intellectuals, activists & commentators like Cornel West, Geoffrey Canada, Juan Williams and others... #2. Amazingly... I agree with Michael Fisher. Although I like Sharptons effort... it is yet to be seen if he is in it for the long haul or in it long enough for the TV cameras. When the TV cameras get tired of his campaign....will he still be there? And will he stop cavorting with these thugs? It's already clear that Simmons and Chavis are loyal to the thug rap community... That's why I suspect that this whole 3 word ban effort could be just a distraction that is designed to legitimize their poison. After the words are banned...then what? What about the damaging behavior that is promoted by thug rap? You can take away the words and thug rappers can (and will) STILL be damaging. I did a post on this about a week ago... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: J.K. EMAIL: IP: 67.70.66.163 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 03:58:44 AM The Angry Independent: I agree with a lot of that, except I'm not sure the people you mention would go to Butler's lengths to defend thug rap (not even Dyson, who I also dislike). In all honesty, Butler is an embarrassment. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 09:47:21 AM I'm confused at what people are saying. Those attacking Paul Butler appear to be the subtle bigots trying to instigate. Paul Bulter points are correct - Sharpton need to attack the establishment, not some 3-word ban which is a weak response to the momentum he generated about this issue. However I have faith in Sharpton that he will make the necessary correction. I also agree with Paul Bulter comment about the church in comparison to hip-hop. The Black church does more damage to Black women than pull leases on them and make them walk like dogs or call them Bs and Hs all the time. The Black church preaches doctrines that brainwash Black women to believe they are subserviant to man and they should be obediant (the surrendered wife syndrome). I'm always shocked at what I hear from Black women who attend these churches who act all holy but sleeping around with the men who attend the church - property syndrome. Most of you guys know what I'm talking about. Let's all be honest about the shifting standards. For a time being, I was seeing Final Call photos of Farrakhan smiling with these same punk corporate hip-hop psuedo-thug jigaboo rappers, so let's keep it real. I actually lost a lot of respect for the Minister hosting those hip-hop summits especially when he initially preached to snatch these fools off the stage in the early nineties. I mean, who the @#$# is more dangerous to the Black male than a punk rapper that sold out to promote the most negative vile image of us for bling? All of our leaders sold out in some way to negative corporate hip-hop. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dorkus EMAIL: IP: 66.91.246.41 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 10:18:57 AM Those attacking Paul Butler appear to be the subtle bigots Translation: There is nothing racist in what you said, but you disagree with me so you must be a racist. The Black church does more damage People who go to church are sinners. You seem to be suggesting that since they are imperfect, the message is wrong. How's ditching that chastity thing working for you? How about forgoing forbearance? What's that? You've got a 70% illegitimacy and 7x the murder rate? Hmm. Maybe you just haven't tried attacking black churches enough. I'll bet they're the problem after all. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 12:22:35 PM Dorkus, You've got a 70% illegitimacy and 7x the murder rate? and you say you are not one of those subtle bigots? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: elvina EMAIL: IP: 68.164.13.47 URL: http://imusshow.net DATE: 05/06/2007 01:41:56 PM Just noticed on drudgereport today this headline - Egypt's blog rebels silenced by jail A popular Egyptian blogger known for his withering criticisms of the government has given up writing after becoming the latest victim of a state crackdown on dissent. Without free speech, it's hard to FIGHT THE POWER - Corporate hip-hop, thug rap - IMHO it's all about *useful idiots* doing the corporate masters bidding - keeping people down and laughing all the way to the bank. Remedy - IMHO - forget about censoring rappers and Imus - but keep the pressure on corporate like Al is - Most of all, promote all the best people - I don't care what race - of course all intelligent, humorous, humane, clever, creative, innovative, accomplished, musical, artistic, intellectual, generous African American people we can - - on websites, TV, stories, movies, in your houses, in your churches - give credit where credit is due - honor all men and women - Focus and highlight the great and positive - That's the BEST way to foil the corporate masters - And it's great to make money - that's another way to foil em - and use your money to promote your values - Love ya - thanks for reading ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: keto EMAIL: IP: 71.59.142.147 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 05:24:54 PM OK, you fools made me download X-Clan--To the East! Sissies!! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Chauncey EMAIL: IP: 169.230.100.245 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 12:48:08 AM Ed, please don't be dumb. pointing out that blacks commit most of the murder and that black dads like to abandon their kids -- i.e., pointing out FACTS -- doesn't make a person a racist. facts, even hurtful ones, aren't racist, and neither is reciting them. again, please don't be stupid. there's simply no maturity on this website. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/07/2007 03:03:41 AM pointing out that we can see mendacious and cognitively impaired motives behind much of the commentary is not an ad hominem attack either, it's a FACT that puppets are in our midst..., ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 68.106.98.16 URL: http://pmsol3.wordpress.com DATE: 05/07/2007 06:40:34 AM The fight does need to be global in that people need to take on those who do the minstrel show and those who pay their bills. It is not hard to fight from two sides simultaneously. Sharpton maybe short sighted but he is trying to do something. What has Prof. Butler done besides apologize for step and fetch it kneegrows willing to sell their soul for a dead white prez? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: ken EMAIL: IP: 70.13.45.225 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 11:30:46 AM "What the hysteria about snitching and hip-hop have in common is people blaming African-American men for much larger cultural problems." I bet it would turn into shouting contest to even try to define the symptoms of these "cultural problems". And tougher still to define the problems. Short sightedness and emotionalism is all we've got. At least he is using the tools he has. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 01:17:02 PM The Black church does more damage to Black women than pull leases on them and make them walk like dogs or call them Bs and Hs all the time. The Black church preaches doctrines that brainwash Black women to believe they are subserviant to man and they should be obediant (the surrendered wife syndrome). I'm always shocked at what I hear from Black women who attend these churches who act all holy but sleeping around with the men who attend the church - property syndrome. Most of you guys know what I'm talking about.//Ed I guess I'm one of the few who doesn't know what you're talking about. In all my years of attending church, I was never taught that black women should be "subservient" to men. I was taught that men and women have certain roles/duties in life, and should perform them accordingly...as for Black women "acting all holy but sleeping around with the men who attend the church", well the same could be applied to the pastor, minister, reverend (usually married with children) who abuses his authority by sleeping with women within and outside of, his congregation...can you say Jesse Jackson? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Makheru EMAIL: IP: 68.222.159.139 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 01:19:07 PM [Elvina, Thanks for the link. Interesting, but I must say that as seductive as the beat and his voice are, yawn, I all hear is more b8tch this, ni88a that, blah blah blah]--Spike How can this person, Immortal Technique, consider himself to be revolutionary while using reactionary language to deliver his message, which he says is for the children. Our young men, in particular, already have enough confusion about what it means to be a man. The last thing they need is someone posing as a revolutionary, whose message can best be described as an example of reactionary masculinity. Revolutionaries don't emulate their oppressors. A colleague of mine compares constant exposure to gangsta rap lyrics and images to being poisoned with arsenic. Everyone has heard about mad spouses who give their partners daily traces of arsenic in their food. One day the partner keels over dead and no one knows why, except, of course the mad spouse. Sometimes after the second or third partner dies, someone finally connects the dots. This gangsta rap game has been running for awhile. Some people are finally starting to connect the dots. And before someone says you can't blame gangsta rap for all of our self-destructive behavior, I agree. You can't blame smoking for all cancer either, but it is a major factor which needs to be addressed to remediate that illness. The same goes for gangsta rap. Makheru ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 01:22:22 PM Sorry...That's me above, NOT Anonymous. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 03:16:46 PM Rhonda do you care to elaborate about these certain gender roles/ duties? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: elvina EMAIL: IP: 69.3.101.194 URL: http://imusshow.net DATE: 05/07/2007 06:18:41 PM Makheru - I don't think Immortal Technique was saying his lyrics are *for the children.* I think he was saying that corporations (media govt establishment) pretend they care about *the children* to justify this or that repressive regulation i.e. social directive, while they make massive dollars promoting gangsta and and other *product* that's bad for children. I think people should control the message, not media, big business or big government - I agree with your other points and changed the video on imusshow.net to an x-clan video - thanks Keto - I think it's a more positive message - but I'm white so maybe I don't know s*** about black culture - ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Ed EMAIL: IP: 68.217.9.240 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 07:44:41 PM //I was taught that men and women have certain roles/duties in life, and should perform them accordingly// Do tell, I'm very interested in hearing this... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Akhenaton06 EMAIL: IP: 162.6.225.66 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 09:19:57 PM I didn't make that particular post about distinctive gender roles, but I agree with that particular poster. For one, maybe we could start with women being the primary caregivers for their children. Biology alone is sufficient to demonstrate that. Take note of the word "primary." ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oakland EMAIL: chambersdean@hotmail.com IP: 76.202.62.160 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 02:23:57 AM Al Sharpton is one of the few people left who are not afraid to say what he thinks. He is not perfect but he scares white people and they really do not like him for the most part! He is becoming the litmus test for whether or not you are a nice Black person or one who wants to blame white people for everything and keep black people in the "I am just a poor victim" mentality. Many people white and black (conservatives) are oh so quick to tell us we are acting like victims every time we assert our rights! It is psychological warfare and Al is the whipping boy that always reminds them that we ain't giving in; Call us whining victims and Al can call you on your stuff because he is still an outside agitator that is not paying favors to anyone but himself. Furthermore he comes with compassion but he does not give black people a pass anymore than some of the conservatives, white or black, so...really he is a voice we need to listen to. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oakland EMAIL: chambersdean@hotmail.com IP: 76.202.62.160 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 02:23:57 AM Al Sharpton is one of the few people left who are not afraid to say what he thinks. He is not perfect but he scares white people and they really do not like him for the most part! He is becoming the litmus test for whether or not you are a nice Black person or one who wants to blame white people for everything and keep black people in the "I am just a poor victim" mentality. Many people white and black (conservatives) are oh so quick to tell us we are acting like victims every time we assert our rights! It is psychological warfare and Al is the whipping boy that always reminds them that we ain't giving in; Call us whining victims and Al can call you on your stuff because he is still an outside agitator that is not paying favors to anyone but himself. Furthermore he comes with compassion but he does not give black people a pass anymore than some of the conservatives, white or black, so...really he is a voice we need to listen to. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oakland EMAIL: chambersdean@hotmail.com IP: 76.202.62.160 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 02:24:44 AM Al Sharpton is one of the few people left who are not afraid to say what he thinks. He is not perfect but he scares white people and they really do not like him for the most part! That is already one reason to take a good look at him! He is becoming the litmus test for whether or not you are a nice Black person or one who wants to blame white people for everything and keep black people in the "I am just a poor victim" mentality. Many people white and black (conservatives) are oh so quick to tell us we are acting like victims every time we assert our rights! It is psychological warfare and Al is the whipping boy that always reminds them that we ain't giving in; Call us whining victims and Al can call you on your stuff because he is still an outside agitator that is not paying favors to anyone but himself. Furthermore he comes with compassion but he does not give black people a pass anymore than some of the conservatives, white or black, so...really he is a voice we need to listen to. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oakland EMAIL: chambersdean@hotmail.com IP: 76.202.62.160 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 02:25:30 AM Al Sharpton is one of the few people left who are not afraid to say what he thinks. He is not perfect but he scares white people and they really do not like him for the most part! That is already one reason to take a good look at him! He is becoming the litmus test for whether or not you are a nice Black person or one who wants to blame white people for everything and keep black people in the "I am just a poor victim" mentality. Many people white and black (conservatives) are oh so quick to tell us we are acting like victims every time we assert our rights! It is psychological warfare and Al is the whipping boy that always reminds them that we ain't giving in; Call us whining victims and Al can call you on your stuff because he is still an outside agitator that is not paying favors to anyone but himself. Furthermore he comes with compassion but he does not give black people a pass anymore than some of the conservatives, white or black, so...really he is a voice we need to listen to. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oakland EMAIL: chambersdean@hotmail.com IP: 76.202.62.160 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 02:26:12 AM Al Sharpton is one of the few people left who are not afraid to say what he thinks. He is not perfect but he scares white people and they really do not like him for the most part! That is already one reason to take a good look at him! He is becoming the litmus test for whether or not you are a nice Black person or one who wants to blame white people for everything and keep black people in the "I am just a poor victim" mentality. Many people white and black (conservatives) are oh so quick to tell us we are acting like victims every time we assert our rights! It is psychological warfare and Al is the whipping boy that always reminds them that we ain't giving in; Call us whining victims and Al can call you on your stuff because he is still an outside agitator that is not paying favors to anyone but himself. Furthermore he comes with compassion but he does not give black people a pass anymore than some of the conservatives, white or black, so...really he is a voice we need to listen to. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 206.37.240.34 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 01:16:24 PM it's fashionable to beat up on hip hop now days because it doesn't fight back, so everyone is doing it. but the minute racism or reparations is mentioned, coons like stanley "crotch" scatter like cockroaches in a sink full of dirty dishes when the lights are turned on. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/08/2007 01:53:50 PM I didn't make that particular post about distinctive gender roles, but I agree with that particular poster. For one, maybe we could start with women being the primary caregivers for their children. Biology alone is sufficient to demonstrate that. Take note of the word "primary." Posted by: Akhenaton06 Without giving a religious sermon, I was taught that a woman should prioritize as follows: A husband/wife put God first in their lives... Then each other... Then the children. In laymen's terms, if a husband and wife lavish love, respect, honor, and yes, sexual attention on each other, together, they can be loving and effective parents. As for roles, men need to understand the importance of their role as husband, father, provider; it is a leadership role, and you simply cannot have a household run by two leaders (I know some sistas here will go ballistic over that statment! LOL!!) But let's understand something...a good man, an effective leader, will certainly welcome, consider, and even implement ideas his wife offers; but ultimately, he is responsible for not only making the FINAL decision, but the RIGHT decisions. Although women work (and sometimes make more money than their spouses), they should still understand THEIR role as wife and mother. She should understand that, whatever job/career/position she holds OUTSIDE the home, that is NOT her primary role; her primary role is to be nuturer and caretaker of her family; to ensure that her home is in order, that it is clean, to cook proper/healthy meals for her husband and child/children. If her job outside the home interferes with her role inside the home, she and hubby need to come to an agreement as to how that problem will be solved...will she cut work parttime, while he picks up extra work, will he work two jobs while she stays home, etc. I think we tend to get our priorities twisted, due to economic issues (yes often two paychecks are needed to run a home), but if kids are eating microwaveable food/fast foods every other night, if a house is in physical and emotional chaos, children are not being given the attention they need (and they need alot of attention), and mom is exhausted and frustrated much of the time, then there is a problem. Like it or not, when it comes to children, women are the PRIMARY caregivers...that doesn't mean in any way that a FATHER is not valid or important in a child's life...he is most important. But it is what it is. Now does that mean that dad can't take on a few domestic chores? Of course not. Should he spend quality time with his children? Sure. But his PRIMARY role is still that of PROVIDER, whether his title is CEO or custodial worker. A woman's PRIMARY role is that of caregiver, nuturer, regardless of how big her office is, or how many degrees are posted on her office wall. We squabble about the problems of the black community...well, this is, in my opinion, one of the BIGGEST problems we face; lack of traditional, intact, two parent households. We talk about poverty being one of the reasons for our problems...yet a few generations ago, married black couples who were poor had children, and in many cases, raised them well...hell, put them through college. Today, there is still poverty...but there is also something missing...something that far too many black women have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nipsey Washington EMAIL: me@jiggaboojones.com IP: 152.132.10.196 URL: http://www.niggajigga.com DATE: 05/08/2007 09:24:29 PM Those three words now fly around on my radio show like flys 'round a dumpster. I refuse to let a hustler like "Honest Al" RE-shape America in to a Communist Oppresionist place where people have to tip toe when they speak. Middle fingers up to people down with that... LANSD ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 08:23:53 AM //but ultimately, he (men) is responsible for not only making the FINAL decision, but the RIGHT decisions.// //Today, there is still poverty...but there is also something missing...something that far too many black women have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock.// Posted by: Rhonda Rhonda is definitely OUT of her mind. One minute she's talking about men being "leaders" and the next minute she is blaming the ills on black women- "something that far too many black women have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock". Isn't this suppose to read as something something that far too many black men have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock- after all men are the leaders according to you? Seriously what are you smoking your posts are almost always inconsistent? And Rhonda my marriage is working well and me and my wife are of equal footing. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 08:30:29 AM Agree with Ed -The Black church does more damage to Black women than pull leases on them and make them walk like dogs or call them Bs and Hs all the time. The Black church preaches doctrines that brainwash Black women to believe they are subserviant to man and they should be obediant (the surrendered wife syndrome). Rhonda is living proof of this. Let's face it some women are excellent caregivers, submissive, etc. while some women are career orientated, ambitious, etc. It's up to people to find their true match. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: CABRIHR EMAIL: IP: 70.94.8.183 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 12:52:15 PM And frankly, with Akon running loose, somebody needs to speak up. RE: IM NOT DEFENDING AKON BUT WHAT HE DID IS A TRINIDAD ISSUE AND HOW WAS HE TO KNOW THE GIRL WAS 15? IN TRINIDAD THE CULTURAL AGE OF AN ADULT IS EARLIER OF THAT FROM AMERICAS STANDARD BUT I GURANTEE YOU THAT IF THE GIRL AKON DID DACNE WITH WAS THAT COUNTRY LEGAL AGE YOU STILL SAY WHAT YOU SAID. about why we American consumers seem to really gravitate toward violence and sexual degredation in mainstream outlets like music, videogames, etc. The top 40 genre seems to be disproportionately vulgar and agressive, and I am not understanding what the cultural payoff is for this type of expression. I RE: RARELY IF EVER I SEE PEOPLE AFTER PLAYING VIDEO GAMES GO OUT AND BEAT PEOPLE UP OR SHOOT RANDOM PEOPLE, VIDEO GAMES HAVE NO INFLUNCE LIKE HIP HOP DOES On the cartoons: I don't recall Danish cartoons being published because corporations were following the buck. In fact, in the fallout, there were boycotts and loss of life and limb along with a great deal of very public debate. And even despite this, other country's papers published the toons as well in solidarity and others like the BBC chose not to. RE: DID YOU KNOW THAT THESE SAME PPL WHO PROTESTED TO THIS CARTOON CAME OUT WITH AN IMAGE OF JESUS AND ALSO DID ONE ON A BLACK WOMAN? BUT ANY ONE WHO DRAWS SOMETHING REMOTELY TO THEM THEY CRY, AND CHANT KILL KILL KILL.... Corporate hip-hop sends negative messages to the Black youth as propaganda warfare - stop snitching, black women are sex objects, be a thug to have credibility - this is what corporate hip-hop mandated and promoting to our youth as a business. RE: ONE THING FIND FUNNY ABOUT THIS IS THAT WHITE CONSERVATIVE CORRESPONDENTS/REPRESENTATIVES NEVER EVER BLAME THERE RIGHT WINGED MONEY MAKING CEO'S OF THE MUSIC INDUSTRY WHO PROMOTE THAT SHIT! We don't need the media, corporate sponsors, or government telling us what we can say and hear - RE: THE MEDIA ALREADY DOES THAT IM PRETTY SURE YOU LISTEN TO TOP 40 RADIO OR CLEAR CHANNEL ,SAME THING PLAYED EVERY HOUR! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 01:37:46 PM Seriously what are you smoking your posts are almost always inconsistent? And Rhonda my marriage is working well and me and my wife are of equal footing. Posted by: Aaron | May 9, 20 What inconsistencies?? I've ALWAYS said that I believe in traditional roles of men and women within a marriage, that there cannot be two leaders within a household. I've ALWAYS said...from a WOMAN'S perspective, that some women continue to negate the importance of fatherhood in conjunction with marriage, by having babies out of wedlock. I LIVE by these beliefs. I am perfectly happy to let my husband "wear the pants" in our family, while I do my thing as wife and mother. And as much as I love my job, if it interfered with my family in a negative way, both my husband agree that I would give it up. And I would be happy to do it, for my family, because their happiness and well being take priority over my job...my family is my PRIMARY responsibility. And while I'm glad your marriage is working well, I never called your marriage into question, so why the need to defend it? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 03:13:31 PM Rhonda here is where you are inconsistent One minute you are talking about men being "leaders" and the next minute you are blaming the ills on black women- "something that far too many black women have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock". Isn't this suppose to read as something something that far too many black men have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock- since after all men are the leaders according to you? (please don't go into this long post about women being primarily responsible for preventing pregnacy, because as someone else has proven you wrong, while the primarily burden falls upon women, the responsiblity lies on both partners.) By the way, there is no need to capitalize your words... I can read well. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 03:24:54 PM And while I'm glad your marriage is working well, I never called your marriage into question, so why the need to defend it? Why do you feel the need to always bring up your marriage and bash on black women for acting like “men”. As you know well, some relationship work out well with men taking charge, others with women taking charge, and many work out well with both partners taking lead? Who cares what you THINK is the ideal black family! So why do you always go to great length explaining (abiet in illogical manners) why the traditional Christian family - man is the head, women is the follower- is the best? If this family model worked out for you, then good for you. However stop acting like this is the "ideal" family model and that the problems afflicting black families are due to the fact that women do not know their "proper" place. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 03:27:31 PM Ooops, meant to write. And while I'm glad your marriage is working well, I never called your marriage into question, so why the need to defend it? Rhonda Why do you feel the need to always bring up your marriage and bash on black women for acting like “men”. As you know well, some relationship work out well with men taking charge, others with women taking charge, and many work out well with both partners taking lead ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Craka Smasha EMAIL: IP: 71.109.49.77 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 10:55:16 PM Rhonda, You may want to ignore the clown known as Aron. He likes to pretend he is either a Black man with a white supremist agenda, or a manipulative white who wants to guide Black people out of ignorance. The family leadership model you prescribe for Black people to develop and empower Black communities is something an ignorant manipulative white person like Aron can not grasp mentally. The dynamics of Black existence in America and white priviledge in America puts Black people in a different frame of mind and on a different path to empowerment. Thus requiring different stategies and disciplines. If you read Aron's drivel it becomes clear that he wants Black people to be just as stupid as he is - just sit around and let whites do all the thinking, while America's "free market economy" cures all of society's racism, discrimination, and abuses. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: BBTPM EMAIL: j.smith@yahoo.com IP: 202.33.24.132 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 12:34:48 AM The Black community does not have to wait for Al Sharpton, Russell Simmons, or anyone else to extinguish this vile, disrespectful, self-loathsome form of entertainment. Black people only need to do four things to end this: a. Stop buying their “music” b. Stop attending their concerts c. Stop patronizing their sponsors d. Take control and stop being so dependent on others to determine their destiny. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 70.108.227.249 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 06:06:24 AM Cracka Smasha You have me confused for the other Aaron (I do not believe the capitalist structure is without its flaws). No I am not a white supremacist so get your facts straight. Rhonda is prescribing a family model that worked best for her... she does not need to speak on behalf of all black folks. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nipesy Washington aka Jiggaboo Jones EMAIL: me@jiggaboojones.com IP: 67.126.131.219 URL: http://www.niggajigga.com DATE: 05/10/2007 10:09:52 AM Al Sharpton is the man who is known for speaking his mind???? ..... W T F ? ..... Ok, so I have been a street guy for maybe too long BUT I will tell you this AL "Shar-let-on" has done NOTHING for street guys trying to GO LEGIT.... as many know the clashes I have had with this GIMP I will be glad when I see two dates under his picture on the news.. meaning the flow of his BS is Over... LANSD..... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Craka Smasha EMAIL: IP: 64.160.149.254 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 10:54:10 AM My apologies to the Aaron who is not the clown. Unfortunately, the clown Aaron is in an attempt to cause confusion among Black people and is using your name. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 01:48:22 PM Who cares what you THINK is the ideal black family!//Aaron I apologize for hijacking this thread, but I need to check Aaron on a couple of issues. First Aaron, I don't know if you're African American or white, nor do I particularly care. I don't "think" a two parent house hold is an ideal environment in which to raise children, I know it is. And while I don't believe that 70% out of wedlock birthrate Dragon Horse keeps harping on, I do know that children who have both parents in the home tend to do better in school, and are less likely to get into trouble, than those whose fathers are not in their lives. A boy needs a father...a fulltime father...to guide him, to teach him how to be a man -- something a woman cannot do, regardless of how much she loves her son. Girls who have their fathers in the home tend to hold off on sexual activity too early, the teen pregnancy rate is less, and their sense of self worth tends to be stronger. The standard of living in a two parent household is better, for obvious reasons. Isn't this suppose to read as something something that far too many black men have negated the importance of fathers, by continuing to have children out of wedlock- since after all men are the leaders according to you?//Aaron No...it reads exactly as it should. First, not EVERY black man possesses the integrity and sense of honor needed to lead; not every man desires the role of leader as respects a family situation. Having said that, it is important that black women recognize those men who are not fit to lead, and avoid these men; however, if they must have sex with them, at least avoid becoming pregnant by them. Perhaps this might be the most important reason why women must be more responsible: it is easy to drag a man into court. It is easy for a judge to order him to pay child support. It's easy for the gov't to garnish his wages. But the MOST important thing a child needs, the gov't cannot garnish from that man...that is the love and nuturing a child needs from his father. If you are a black man, then you more than anyone should know the importance of intact black families. Mothers raising children in homes without husband/fathers is NOT an ideal situation in which to raise a child, and I cannot understand why any black woman would so selfish as to do it. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 02:36:48 PM Okay Sorry that I even bothered with you. This is the same garbage you spew all the time ... blaming black women for all the problems (making me believe that you have issues with yourself and other black women). Just for one minute listen to the nonsense you talk. First you call black men leaders, then by recoginizing not all men are leaders, you call upon black women to identify these so called black men who are not leaders. Well if if it up to women to choose out these "leaders" then the it is only evident that women are leaders themeslves- hence this is my original point that leadership roles is ideal when shared. So then we are left with your nonsense drivel, men are leaders, but when problems occur (such as sinlge family house) it is the fault of black women because black women do not properly choose out black male leaders. What nonsense is this? If one belives that men are leaders, then fault them (men) for not being able to keep their house in check. It only makes logical since. Then to top off your nonsense this is what you state //Perhaps this might be the most important reason why women must be more responsible// ROTFLMBAO. If women must be more responsible, then likewise they should be the "leaders". LOL.. But most importantly, here is where you do not make ANY sense- if men are leaders and women must bow to their authority then we cannot fault the problems of the black community on women, can we? And last, why do you feel the need to always bring up your marriage and bash on black women for acting like “men” or being the root cause of all the problems in black neighborhoods. As you know well, some relationship work out well with men taking charge, others with women taking charge, and many work out well with both partners taking lead. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 02:47:37 PM rhonda There's no need to reply if you do not care to make rational sense. If you believe all of this because your pastor/ bible, etc. says so, then that's on you. The site is called blackprof so most the people here expect to read rational posts (logical/ backed by facts), not what Rhonda irrationality believes. While your marriage is working well that's good for you... yet don't irrationally argue that this is the "ideal" marriage/ family when there are many happy family who do not adhere to your beliefs. Furhtemore do not even attempt to place sole/ majority of blame on women when someone here clearly explained to you the difference between "burden" and "responsiblity". ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 06:28:16 PM I'll respond like this: Before I married, I had my share of fun as respects men. Didn't matter if they were husband/father/leadership material not. My goal was to have a good time, not settle down. I protected myself against unwanted pregnancy, by using birth control, and insisting my partner used a condom. When I felt the desire to settle down, I sought out men who would be good husband/father/provider and yes, leader material. I met one, fell in love, married him, and had a child. I had a child with my husband...not a fuck buddy. See the difference? End of discussion. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 69.15.230.105 URL: DATE: 05/10/2007 10:17:03 PM I wonder if Sharpton will address a national radio program's call to rape the highest-ranking black woman in America? http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=450 Since she's a Republican, probably not. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/11/2007 08:18:29 AM Rhonda I never asked you to explain the difference between fuck buddies and a husband so there's no need to spew nonsense irrevelant garbage. What worked out good for you is simply ONLY good for you. I, and many others, could care less about your personal experiences. Don't sit on your high horse telling others (incorrectly) what the "ideal" black family is. Understand? (I think you do wish is why you can't explain your inconsistencies) End of discussion. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 4.79.229.69 URL: DATE: 05/11/2007 08:21:52 AM OOps I meant Understand? (I think you do which is why you can't explain your inconsistencies) ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Oregon EMAIL: IP: 70.162.116.15 URL: DATE: 05/12/2007 10:42:53 AM Why doesn't nappy headed Sharpton go after opie & anthony for their filth on the radio? Oh, that's it--he hates Condi and would appear two faced to defend her. AS is a spineless turd that needs to be flushed!! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nipsey Washington EMAIL: me@jiggaboojones.com IP: 152.132.10.197 URL: http://www.niggajigga.com DATE: 05/12/2007 05:54:00 PM Al Shar-let-on is a glory hunting phony! You try to call into his show and ONLY those that agree with him get on. He does not like to debate the facts as seen on Hannity & Combs.... Pull the plug and throw the curtain back on this fool. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: spike the cat EMAIL: IP: 81.208.36.89 URL: DATE: 05/13/2007 07:23:25 AM Aaron says:"Just for one minute listen to the nonsense you talk. First you call black men leaders, then by recoginizing not all men are leaders, you call upon black women to identify these so called black men who are not leaders. Well if its up to women to choose out these "leaders" then the it is only evident that women are leaders themeslves- hence this is my original point that leadership roles is ideal when shared." Brilliant. Thank you. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: RavenRavings EMAIL: IP: 66.41.74.212 URL: DATE: 05/14/2007 02:17:28 AM What is objectionable about this post is the professor's call for a different emphasis in SHARPTON'S leadership. If the black church needs correcting, then why doesn't Butler do it himself. It doesn't condemn Sharpton to emphasize Hip Hop's problems--and not the church (assuming, for purposes of argument, that the church has the failings Butler identifies.) Sharpton is an older gentleman. He can't do everything. He can just choose one thing to do--the thing that is important to him--or that he has already emphasized--and has sufficient independence from to critique. Apparently Butler has no connection to the black church, Butler then should take the church on. Will Butler take on the church for the sins he claims the Church commits? No, he won't. He'll write a blog--a short article--but he will not take the time out of his schedule to mount a sustain attack. Why? Because he is faking a commitment. It would be inconvenient to his lifestyle. Not easy. And this is why I find it laughable when this supposed second or third generation of blacks "leaders" criticize Sharpton or a Jesse--as Butler does. These younger folks--though they criticize--are just not ready for primetime. They expect the reigns f leadership to be handed over to them--on the way to the glf tee--to buddy it up with their colleages. Noo. They're very disrespectful--criticizing the older leaders for just talk--when they are not even prepared to just talk on a sustained basis--if there is even the hint of personal cost. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: katrina in L.A. EMAIL: IP: 130.166.31.87 URL: DATE: 05/15/2007 12:59:30 AM Yeah, but nobody should overlook that there is also a reoccurring verdict when 'she' is black and in her 20s or teens. Without fail, every time I have been treated disrespectfully based on my genderandrace (ran together on purpose) it has been by some fool using hip-hop imitations as a guise for his or her own racist and sexist views, pretending that he or she could "identify" with those black guys rapping. Let Al Sharpton go get those guys. For the most part, church has been the only place where any male I've ever known was not primarily inclined to treat me disrespectfully just because I am not male. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: towninflorida EMAIL: IP: 66.0.144.194 URL: DATE: 05/17/2007 04:23:01 PM If the black church is so great for the black community, why has it kept quiet and in denial about HIV and AID's, that is actively wiping out the black community? What people fail to realise is that the Rev.Sharpton's and Jesse Jackson's and the black church in general, is out of touch with the people it most needs to reach out to. The black church is antiquated and that is why so many of our black youth cannot relate to it and instead they gravitate towards hip-hop and other negative influences as their role models. If Sharpton really want's to make a difference, he should start with the black church, which has historically brought black people together in the past. Times have changed and the church needs to as well. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/18/2007 01:39:50 PM Actually, some black churches are dealing with the issue of HIV/AIDS as respect prevention of this disease; however, they are doing so from a religious perspective. They are promoting abstinence amongst single people, particularly young adults/teens, and faithfulness/fidelity within a marriage. The black church is reluctant to discuss condom use because, from it's viewpoint, it promotes premarital and extramarital sex...something the church/christian religion frowns upon. So while the black church does hold seminars about HIV/AIDS treatment and prevention, don't expect those cute how-to-put-on-a-condom-properly demonstrations using a banana or a model of a penis. Not happening. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Abel EMAIL: asalag@yahoo.com IP: 66.199.250.218 URL: http://djakon.net/smoking/smoking.html DATE: 05/25/2007 02:56:28 PM a bad job ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Zion EMAIL: chmoore@siue.edu IP: 4.245.17.210 URL: DATE: 06/04/2007 09:54:22 AM I find it amazing how the black churh has become the target of so much criticism yet it was the basis for our original Civil Rights Movement. Now, admittedly, there are some teachings that have been misinterpreted in order to suit a male-dominated culture, but that is with any church (black, white, whatever). Yes, hip-hop needs to be called on the carpet period. How did a vehicle for civil rights and justice turn into a commercialized vehicle glamourizing sex, violence, and unspeakable life styles? Simple. Like everything that black America latches on to, we allow the dominating white culture to treat us like whores. Just simply show us the money, and we will tap-dance for that almighty dollar. Hip-Hop has become another black face, just in a different form. While I am not the biggest fan of Sharpton or Jackson, did the white media have a valid argument when they called us out on our own disrespect towards one another. Also, we need to redefine hip-hop and allow the real hip-hop to dominate the air waves, not this commercialized pop music. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: zvljiubg ijpknfsl EMAIL: crsphtulf@mail.com IP: 59.106.23.152 URL: http://www.hsglwdv.ycwaur.com DATE: 08/11/2007 09:39:47 AM zwknqb bgyufnctj msrnelf myhkuirez xtny rkbdao izgbnweu ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: kcpz wfzs EMAIL: fjdvs@mail.com IP: 218.246.96.46 URL: http://www.google.com DATE: 08/11/2007 09:40:44 AM hgtkx kuzog mkqp ilvzyt ldtvki tkysh rlovpksw http://www.twrybfdk.wjkar.com ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: porno EMAIL: puwx@hotmail.com IP: 194.228.61.99 URL: http://homeloanswithbadcredit.blogspot.com/ DATE: 08/19/2007 06:59:23 PM Cool site. Thanks. http://homeloanswithbadcredit.blogspot.com/ porno ----- -------- AUTHOR: sifill TITLE: Uncle Ben's and Racial Stereotypes in Advertising STATUS: Publish ALLOW COMMENTS: 1 CONVERT BREAKS: tinymce ALLOW PINGS: 1 PRIMARY CATEGORY: race CATEGORY: race DATE: 05/04/2007 01:27:38 AM ----- BODY:
I don’t care much about the latest controversy involving the $20 million ad campaign launched by Mars Co., the owners of the Uncle Ben’s Rice brand, in which “Uncle Ben” is now “Chairman Ben” (still no last name). Who cares? I’ve never purchased either Uncle Ben’s rice or Aunt Jemima syrup. But I really enjoyed this slide show about the historical use of racist stereotypes in advertising. For a visit to Uncle Ben’s new “office,” go to www.unclebens.com
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AUTHOR: Dorkus
EMAIL:
IP: 72.255.51.72
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DATE: 05/04/2007 05:20:52 AM
Well that wasn't a total waste of time. Nope! Very worthwhile. Thanks for the post. Great job. Uncle Ben's is racist. Hey, I just realized that some rice is white! How about a follow up post about that? Darn that old rice anyhow!
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AUTHOR:
EMAIL:
IP: 134.60.11.31
URL:
DATE: 05/04/2007 05:36:44 AM
These stereotypes are nothing compared to what I see in Europe, I feel pretty powerless since they are really offensive.
As I said before there is even a chocolate type known as negerkuss... i,e "niggerkiss".
There has to be a way to stop this especially in Europe where there are no advocacy groups fighting against such things
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COMMENT:
AUTHOR: Dorkus
EMAIL:
IP: 72.255.51.72
URL:
DATE: 05/04/2007 05:39:52 AM
By the way, thanks for the link to Uncle Ben's. What a contrast with blackprof.com!
One site is cleverly done, beautiful to look at and has a strong dose of self-deprecating humor that helps makes its points with style and grace. The other is a bunch of professors screaming "Racism!" at every leaf that blows in front of their faces.
I'll be picking up a bunch of tips for my own websites from Uncle Ben's for a long time to come. The animated Day Planner in his office was great!
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AUTHOR: dilettante
EMAIL:
IP: 81.129.137.64
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DATE: 05/04/2007 07:10:55 AM
I like the old uncle Ben better. The slide show was informative, Like it or not this is our [American- black and white] history. I'm glad the more outrageous images are gone- I don't have a problem with the current Aunt Jemima image, or the the prior uncle Ben. The problem I have with the *makeover* is that it gives an image to the white fantasy of what affirmative action is/was all about. One day a black person is a cook- the next he's a CEO just like that. I do not/ would not buy any of the products- but I don't begrudge the companies trying to capitalize on their product'slong history. Line from the Godfather- "after all- we are not communist."
The comments on the blog the other day about O'Bama &'acting white'-- missed the fact that white people are just as complicit and actually hold more power in perpetuating this idea. I know many of us have had the 'interview' by some white person who feels they have a right to ask invasive questions about how/why we have a certain job, education, lifestyle etc. Or my personal favorite- What do your parents do?? -from people I have just met, wtf? This happens when they can't say flat out-- YOU'RE BLACK, WHY ARE YOU DOING X?- implicit in this is their view that X is for WHITE PEOPLE I'm not sure how conscious even they are of having a view of what is appropriate for 'whites only'. Can you imagine a marketing campaign to "see "the inside of the office of the actual CEO of Mars/Master food?- (who I'm sure has a last name)? No, Im sure you can't. The manufacturing process, the cocoa plants where the chocolate comes from, or some fiction about how well they treat their suppliers- that might be marketed. But there is no novelty in seeing a white mans office- that's "normal".
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COMMENT:
AUTHOR: Al
EMAIL: abrophy@law.ua.edu
IP: 76.27.137.41
URL:
DATE: 05/04/2007 09:30:35 AM
Sherrilyn--thanks for this, especially the Slate slideshow.
Uncle Ben's website is amazing. Did anyone else look at the history section? I actually enjoyed learning about rice--some pretty interesting stuff there. But, more importantly, it's a classic in the selective memory genre. Lots of stuff left out. Fascinating how they're dealing their history....
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COMMENT:
AUTHOR: cnulan
EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com
IP: 65.69.77.51
URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net
DATE: 05/04/2007 09:57:21 AM
But, more importantly, it's a classic in the selective memory genre. Lots of stuff left out. Fascinating how they're dealing their history....ain't that the truth!
By the way, thanks for the link to Uncle Ben's. What a contrast with blackprof.com! One site is cleverly done, beautiful to look at and has a strong dose of self-deprecating humor that helps makes its points with style and grace. The other is a bunch of professors screaming "Racism!" at every leaf that blows in front of their faces."beautiful to look at" as contrasted with hard to look at, hard to come to grips with an ugly, ugly recent history - won't you negroes try to forget and ignore? tickles me no end to hear these disingenuous squeals of protest..., Anamnesis binds us with the world in an essential way.
It places us in the centre of the world's proceedings, of its pains, of its deepest quests. It reminds us that Christ's work of salvation concerns the entire world; it embraces the whole universe, earth and heaven, "all things". The church, "which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all" (Eph.1:23), cannot be shut in itself and take thought only for itself. The church lives "for the whole world". With its prayer, its message, its interests, its action, it embraces all the pains of humanity, the exploitation of individuals or groups, the multifaceted oppression of women and children, the local clashes, the global financial unrest and injustice, and deepening ecological threats. The church offers the holy gifts "in all and for all".----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Aaron EMAIL: IP: 198.31.170.156 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:05:28 AM Now this is the pinnacle of ridiculousness! "Uncle Ben's" image is meant to portray the homemade quality of the food. The company wants us to see Uncle Ben and imagine that we're purchasing the result of a family recipe passed down from generation to generation. Uncle/Chairman Ben has a kind and honest face. He's elderly which is meant to make us believe that the recipe is the result of a lifetime spent perfecting the recipe. No one looks at a package of Uncle Ben's rice and actually believes that most black people are just like Uncle Ben. That's absurd. And how is this any different than commercials for Vlasic pickles (that could be seen as stereotyping Jews) or the Taco Bell dog (that could be seen as sterotyping Mexicans)? Like it or not kosher pickles are associated with Jews and mexican food (if Taco Bell even fits the bill), believe it or not, is associated with Mexicans. Consumers like to believe they are purchasing an authentic product. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: kyle EMAIL: kyle@spam.com IP: 207.47.5.100 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:34:11 AM That slide show was well worth the visit. It's so easy to look back in moral satisfaction at the prejudices of yesteryear and so hard to look at ourselves (myself included) in the mirror. So what are we to make of this phrase in the slide show, which was on the page with the Chief Wahoo picture? The accompanying text says that Chief Wahoo was "grinning like a frat boy at an orgy." Wow. Fighting fire with fire? Prejudice to combat prejudice? "Good" stereotyping to counter "bad" stereotyping? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: LFT EMAIL: IP: 138.163.0.41 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 12:13:24 PM I agree with Aaron. Uncle Ben's these aren't: http://www.ferris.edu/news/jimcrow/caricature/ http://www.ferris.edu/news/jimcrow/cartoons/ ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cmoney EMAIL: IP: 38.102.195.118 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 12:24:31 PM Aaron: You have no clue about the history of African-Americans in this country if you think that the choice of the name and image of Uncle Ben was some innocent portrayal of some arbitrary cook or waiter. Rice was farmed by African slaves and was associated with southern Blacks because it was pretty much brought here by Africans during the slave trade. It was a major slave product produced in South Carolina. While we today tend to associate rice with Asian foods, that was not the case when Uncle Ben's was introduced. It was a southern dish and in the South, the cooks and servants of the well to do were Black. Using the image of Uncle Ben--a servant to wealthy White people--provided this rice product with an upscale image--at the expense of Black people. This image stereotyped Black men as servants and harkened to an era when Blacks knew their place. You are looking at the box from your modern post civil rights perspective, not from the Jim Crow perspective in which it was developed. Even today, you see nothing wrong with this servile image of a Black man. As for the Taco Bell dog, in case you haven't noticed, that campaign was ended. Why? Because many Mexican-Americans found that ad distasteful and offensive. If there had been TV ads back when Uncle Ben first came out, it would have looked like a Step-n-Fetch-It Minstrel show. I don't think there would be any doubt about the image that Uncle Ben was portraying--an old, un-educated, shuffling, freed slave that's jus' happy to be alive and serving these good Whtie folk! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/04/2007 02:04:57 PM Is it just me, or does this image of Chairman Ben call to mind the Honorable Elijah Muhammad? That bowtie is giving me a hankering for some whitefish and beanpie...., ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 02:09:53 PM No one looks at a package of Uncle Ben's rice and actually believes that most black people are just like Uncle Ben. That's absurd.//Aaron You'd be surprised at what people actually believe. Folks still think that black men have enormous penises; if they're that stupid to believe that, it's not impossible that they'd think that black folks are like Uncle Ben. White America, believe it or not, longs for the days when "It's Darkies" were docile and happy. If you are anything other than that, you are perceived as having an attitude, or you are angry. I still get that, "Are you okay, are you upset about something?" when I'm at my desk, working intently. My response is always, "No, I'm not upset, I'm busy, can I help you with something?" ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/04/2007 02:40:10 PM
You'd be surprised at what people actually believe. Folks still think that black men have enormous penises; if they're that stupid to believe that, it's not impossible that they'd think that black folks are like Uncle Ben.HEY, HEY, HEY, HEY, HEY!!!!! What the hell? Slow your role sister, don't go talkin out of class like THAT now! I mean dayyum....let's not get hasty and start airing out trade secrets in public! (^; ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: bigmaconcampus EMAIL: IP: 208.27.111.121 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 03:21:09 PM "White America, believe it or not, longs for the days when "It's Darkies" were docile and happy." what, you don't want to be happy? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Chauncey EMAIL: IP: 169.230.100.245 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 04:47:32 PM is "uncle ben" a euphemism for "uncle tom"? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: maleficent cat EMAIL: IP: 81.208.36.89 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 06:01:49 PM "Uncle Ben's" image is meant to portray the homemade quality of the food...Consumers like to believe they are purchasing an authentic product" OK, but it's a freakin' box of rice for crying out loud! If consumers are that thick in the head, then damn...I don't even know what to say... A box of rice?!Americans really need to get out more, I mean the last time I bought a bag of rice, the bag was clear and just said "rice" on it... P.s. the slide show was informative, although I have to agree with kyle, that some of the comments in the slide show were a bit much... cmoney's take is all there needs to be said on the rest... ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 65.69.77.51 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/04/2007 07:25:24 PM speaking of images that make me go hmm...., ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: tio ben EMAIL: IP: 72.76.3.157 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:52:14 PM Hola amigos..I'm all over this topic like white on rice...ya know, pa que sepas.. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: tio ben EMAIL: IP: 72.76.3.157 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:54:14 PM Hola amigos..I'm all over this topic like white on rice...ya know, pa que sepas.. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: tio ben EMAIL: IP: 72.76.3.157 URL: DATE: 05/04/2007 11:59:04 PM Hola amigos..I'm all over this topic like white on rice...ya know, pa que sepas.. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: deb EMAIL: IP: 70.124.86.36 URL: DATE: 05/06/2007 05:13:30 PM The very fact that rice is white should concern us all. After all, why should anything which keeps half of the world alive be "white." That's so wrong! As for "black widow" anything, let me just say that putting down on the black culture is despicable. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: EMAIL: IP: 68.106.98.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 06:44:40 AM Rhoda: "Folks still think that black men have enormous penises;" Uhm enormous is not true, but bigger on average? yes. Even the UN (World Health Organization) agrees. :-) "The World Health Organization bases its specifications for condom width on consumer preference and penis size, citing three studies. Taken together, the studies show significant variations in penis size within all population groups, but also indicate that men of African descent on average have a slightly wider and longer penis size, Caucasian men have a medium size, and Asian men a slightly narrower and shorter size. (WHO)" http://whqlibdoc.who.int/hq/1998/WHO_RHT_FPP_98.15_spec&guidelines.pdf on pg. 65 ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 68.106.98.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 06:46:11 AM last post was me. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Rhonda EMAIL: IP: 165.125.144.16 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 01:44:12 PM men of African descent on average have a slightly wider and longer penis size, Caucasian men have a medium size, and Asian men a slightly narrower and shorter size. (WHO)" http://whqlibdoc.who.int/hq/1998/WHO_RHT_FPP_98.15_spec&guidelines.pdf on pg. 65 Posted by: Anonymous The key word being SLIGHTLY...as opposed to the prevailing myth that black men's penises are so much longer and thicker than those of men of other ethnicities. As for Uncle Ben, I haven't bought it in years...but when I look at the picture, I tend to want to cringe, as I do when I look at the picture on the box of Cream of Wheat. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Dragon Horse EMAIL: bolezn@hotmail.com IP: 162.6.224.224 URL: http://pmsol3.wordpress.com DATE: 05/07/2007 02:43:16 PM Well yeah Rhonda...you are right, this goes to the Mandingo stereotype that black men basically have a "third leg" and are basically animalistic/primitives. (sigh)...I also agree when I see Uncle Men or Aunt Jamima I think of slaves...I always have, since late elementary school. They have tried to update Aunt Jamimima's image too, but it is too late for that. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: John Holmes EMAIL: IP: 71.109.49.77 URL: DATE: 05/07/2007 11:20:37 PM Looks like DH has done his homework on penis sizes. Apparently he is not ignorant on everything. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nipsey washington EMAIL: me@jiggaboojones.com IP: 152.132.10.196 URL: http://www.niggajigga.com DATE: 05/08/2007 09:17:59 PM Well you know if you look hard enough ANYTHING can be racist..... So what Uncle Bens rice Aunt J syrup. Grew up with them and never felt bad about that. with such more important issues to be tackle all I ask is so what and why?? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nipsey washington EMAIL: me@jiggaboojones.com IP: 152.132.10.196 URL: http://www.niggajigga.com DATE: 05/08/2007 09:18:45 PM Well you know if you look hard enough ANYTHING can be racist..... So what Uncle Bens rice Aunt J syrup. Grew up with them and never felt bad about that. with such more important issues to be tackle all I ask is so what and why?? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: BBTPM EMAIL: j.smith@yahoo.com IP: 202.33.24.132 URL: DATE: 05/09/2007 11:27:35 PM There are more important issues than fictional characters from yesteryear. That was an entirely different era... Time would be better spent focusing on real issues that affect the Black community. These issues would include, but are not limited to self exploitation by Black people in today's entertainment industry. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: hey you EMAIL: IP: 152.163.100.8 URL: DATE: 06/05/2007 08:44:50 PM I totally agree with aron sorry ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: owhnle rumf EMAIL: uvwh@mail.com IP: 194.112.113.78 URL: http://www.umztjdofl.esab.com DATE: 08/18/2007 07:40:04 AM cuvnjpf sgknyb nxtosv rqkscfuyl qxfvpswm cvziaybpt cxeovsmp ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: owhnle rumf EMAIL: uvwh@mail.com IP: 209.97.195.208 URL: http://www.umztjdofl.esab.com DATE: 08/18/2007 07:41:04 AM cuvnjpf sgknyb nxtosv rqkscfuyl qxfvpswm cvziaybpt cxeovsmp ----- -------- AUTHOR: lharris TITLE: Should Black Folks Die in Iraq, Too? STATUS: Publish ALLOW COMMENTS: 1 CONVERT BREAKS: tinymce ALLOW PINGS: 1 PRIMARY CATEGORY: race CATEGORY: race DATE: 05/03/2007 11:05:58 AM ----- BODY:
Thanks for the introduction. I am gratified by the opportunity to post on BlackProf, certainly one of the successful blogs on the Internet.
I want to start off by posting about Iraq and black involvement (or the lack thereof). The military has had a tough time meeting there recruiting goals to meet the twin demands of Iraq and Afghanistan, even though the military has lowered standards and increased spending sharply to recruit. Still, as reported today in a newspaper article, all the major Democratic candidates for this year want to increase the size of ground forces. (http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/08-hopefuls-would-grow-the-military-2007-05-02.html). Part of the recruiting problem has to be African Americans, which the military has had a particularly tough time recruiting. According to National Public Radio (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4561618&sc=emaf), African Americans recruits to the Army are down 41% since 2000.
The sharp drop in African American recruits is surprising, considering that there is long history (or trope?) of African Americans being over-represented in uniform. The decline in African American enlistees is even more surprising, given that military service has never had so many benefits from combat pay to enlistment bonuses to tuition assistance. In some sense, Latinos may be picking up the slack. Over the same period of the decline in African American enlistment, the number of Latinos enlistees is rising fast. One reporter has noted the prevalence of bumper stickers in Florida that read: “Yo Soy Army.” What’s going on? Why the change of heart among African Americans? Whether a hawk or a dove, the military does offer significant benefits for those that enlist, like those mentioned, but also a marketable skill set, exposure to a diverse group of individuals and other cultures, and discipline, among others. Thus, is it a good thing that African Americans are increasingly disinclined to enlist?
----- EXTENDED BODY: ----- EXCERPT: ----- KEYWORDS: ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cnulan EMAIL: cnulan@oeiad.com IP: 70.12.44.220 URL: http://www.frontlinemultimedia.net DATE: 05/03/2007 11:19:55 AM Dr. Sonja Ebron spelled it out years ago...,What are we to do? Recognize that Black well being in the U.S. and around the world will be adversely impacted by our government's war for oil. Recognize that an oil war, by increasing the costs of energy, threatens oil-importing developing economies everywhere, especially those in Africa and South America, as well as Black America's. Recognize that the war to control the world's oil is in the late planning stages but is early in its implementation and can be stopped. Recognize that Martin was killed because of the moral authority he brought to the Vietnam anti-war movement, drawn from his use of the "race card," and that the African American community retains that authority. Recognize that our ability to drive domestic response to an immoral foreign policy is what keeps the warmongers up at night. Recognize that thoughtful Black people, from Nelson Mandela to your next-door neighbor, are against this war for two reasons: because it is against Black interests - in the U.S., in central and South America, in Africa - and because it is so very terribly wrong. Talk to your friends and family about your opposition to the war. Stick an anti-war poster in your yard and a bumper sticker on your car. Join or help organize a local or national protest. Call, write, email and visit your congressional representatives. Take a few "sick days" from work, and don't buy anything you don't absolutely need. Get behind the anti-war movement now, before it's too late.----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: nunya EMAIL: queernunya@aol.com IP: 141.211.81.206 URL: http://queerthinker.blogspot.com DATE: 05/03/2007 11:48:45 AM So...blacks are supposed to put their lives on the lines because good benefits are offered?! For a nation that doesn't really even consider us Americans? Latinos might be that delusional (after all, to many of them, America is better than where they're originally from), but apparently we're not. Plus, maybe if there weren't a nonsensical war going on right now, more blacks would be enlisting. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: nunya EMAIL: queernunya@aol.com IP: 141.211.81.206 URL: http://queerthinker.blogspot.com DATE: 05/03/2007 11:49:53 AM So...blacks are supposed to put their lives on the lines because good benefits are offered?! For a nation that doesn't really even consider us Americans? Latinos might be that delusional (after all, to many of them, America is better than where they're originally from), but apparently we're not. Plus, maybe if there weren't a nonsensical war going on right now, more blacks would be enlisting. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Craka Smasha EMAIL: IP: 64.160.149.254 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 11:50:28 AM The best way to recruit Black people into the armed forces: Establish and maintain a system of racial equality and justice in the United States. Period. When the people of this nation decide they are tired and fed up with white supremacy, that is what will result. Until then Black people have no business in the U. S. armed forces carrying out white supremist imperialism goals. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Cincinnati NAMjA EMAIL: covrider1978@yahoo.com IP: 192.122.237.11 URL: http://namjablog.blogspot.com DATE: 05/03/2007 12:35:08 PM I think that it is great that the number of African Americans enlisting in the Armend Forces are dropping. It means that there are grater oppurtunities for is on the "out side". ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: cmoney EMAIL: IP: 38.102.195.118 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 12:49:02 PM Nobody should be dying in Iraq-Black, White, Latino, Asian, Arab--nobody. Blacks are abandoning the armed forces because our country has gone off the deep end philosophically and has delusional leadership. This war and this administration is simply not worth dying for and African-Americans see that more clearly than most. Let all those who voted for Bush enlist and die. The world would be a better place with fewer of them around. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nana EMAIL: IP: 71.249.189.209 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 01:05:34 PM I left the Nam and joined the Panters and the Lords. So you know where I stand. Not one of my children went into the service. When a society can now send both parents to war and leave children with grandparents, how can they say they believe in family values? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Nana EMAIL: IP: 71.249.189.209 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 01:10:47 PM The use of well trained personnel to work with other nations is what should be. Not to go to war but to stop genocide! The service we should push is sending qualified folks into the communities. On a yearly bases. Civil Duties!!! ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: ETS EMAIL: escott@alumni.unc.edu IP: 204.155.172.17 URL: http://www.nubianoproject.com DATE: 05/03/2007 01:11:02 PM Blacks should die if they want to die ... not because they enlisted in the military because it was their only outlet. If they wanted to die on purpose, they could have just gone with plan A. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: BT EMAIL: IP: 71.126.173.248 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 01:20:02 PM Why should black folks fight for a government installed by Jim Crow vote rigging, whose every move is in antithesis to our basic human interests? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: AnnabelleDickson EMAIL: IP: 131.118.39.36 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 01:24:59 PM Yo soy Army. -- Are you kidding me? If Black folks are finding better opportunities elsewhere then yes, it is a good thing that our numbers in the military are declining. If it's an act of political protest, even better. If the numbers are declining due to Backs being unable to qualify for service then the answer becomes no and it speaks to other issues. I think I'm more interested in why the numbers are declining as opposed to whether or not it's good or bad. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: Chauncey EMAIL: IP: 169.230.100.245 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 02:29:39 PM well, if blacks aren't going into the army because they have better job opportunities at home, doesn't that mean that blacks are progressing instead of regressing socioeconomically, quite contrary to the "victimhood" logic of the black left? ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: E.C. Hopkins EMAIL: IP: 71.220.154.164 URL: http://www.maxambit.com DATE: 05/03/2007 02:33:22 PM The profession of U.S. Soldier is still the noblest profession in a world where our and other nations’ leaders are willing to risk the lives of thousands of their bravest citizens in order to achieve their political economic objectives. In the U.S., we select our leaders. We elect them and give them the power to start or end our wars. We contribute the tax dollars that pay for annual $500 billion U.S. Department of Defense budgets. So, our soldiers fight for us when we decide to go to war against nations or ideas. Our soldiers stay at war until we decide to bring them home. U.S. soldiers transform our tough words turn into tough action. Soldiers walk our political economic talk. That’s the vocation. The noblest vocation. I believe more U.S. citizens would use their power to send our soldiers to war or bring our soldiers home more judiciously if a higher percentage of us had served in the military. And, I still believe most U.S. citizens, of all social classes, could benefit from military training and experiences. I am a U.S. Air Force Academy graduate and a former military officer. Since graduating in 1995, I’ve advised many Black men and women who were considering joining the military by enlisting, by completing an ROTC program, or by completing an Officer Training School program. I also spent my first year as a commissioned military officer working with the Academy’s admissions office in a position that enabled me to work almost exclusively with its minority candidates. While in this position, I travelled to more than a dozen major U.S. cities to promote, not to recruit for, the Academy. Few of the lower-class or middle-class Black high school students in Detroit, Pittsburgh, Los Angeles, Seattle, Oakland, and other cities I visited knew about their U.S. Air Force Academy or their U.S. Naval Academy or their U.S. Coast Guard Academy. Most had heard of West Point. Few knew the differences between military officers and enlisted members. So, I spent a lot of time educating Black students, teachers, counselors, community leaders, and parents about their country’s military organization and the various types of military careers and opportunities. I also spent a lot of time addressing concerns about being Black in the military. I didn’t attempt to convince Black students that everything bad they had heard about being Black in the military was wrong. I did spend a lot of time telling them about the very important history of Blacks in the military, the many Blacks who had greatly benefitted from their military careers, and the ways they might be able to benefit greatly from careers as military officers. I also shared my personal story with them. Unfortunately, anti-military sentiments in our Black communities are even stronger these days than they were while I held that job. Personally, I am unconvinced our war in Iraq is either just or necessary. And, I hope more of my fellow citizens will begin to use their political and economic influence in order to get our soldiers out of Iraq faster. Even so, I would still advise most talented young Black men and women to strongly consider military careers. The profession of the U.S. Soldier is still the noblest vocation there is. RECOMMENDED BOOK American Patriots: The Story of Blacks in the Military from the Revolution to Desert Storm (ISBN 0375502793), by Gail Buckley. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: rusty EMAIL: IP: 72.43.116.93 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 02:37:48 PM "even in the Army, African Americans in the volunteer force are more likely to enlist in administrative, medical, and support specialties rather than in combat specialties. In the context of current combat operations in Iraq, these differences are not as important as they would be in a conventional war: In Iraq, there is no front line, and all military personnel are potential combatants." http://www.prb.org/Articles/2005/ArmyRecruitmentGoalsEndangeredasPercentofAfricanAmericanEnlisteesDeclines.aspx ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: keto EMAIL: IP: 15.251.169.70 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 03:17:46 PM "The profession of U.S. Soldier is still the noblest profession in a world where our and other nations’ leaders are willing to risk the lives of thousands of their bravest citizens in order to achieve their political economic objectives. In the U.S., we select our leaders. We elect them and give them the power to start or end our wars. We contribute the tax dollars that pay for annual $500 billion U.S. Department of Defense budgets. So, our soldiers fight for us when we decide to go to war against nations or ideas. Our soldiers stay at war until we decide to bring them home. U.S. soldiers transform our tough words turn into tough action. Soldiers walk our political economic talk. That’s the vocation. The noblest vocation." Are you kidding me? Drop the motherhood and apple pie. The events of the last 7 years have effectively negated your paragraph. It is not noble to fight a rich man's war. To encourage our youth to enlist at this time is simply criminal. We are fighting against neither a nation nor ideas. We are a for occupying a few patches of land in a multi-party civil war. We have killed and tortured many so that our puppet government can give US-based oil companies legal permission to exploit another people's natural resources. What's so noble about that? Noblest profession? I beg to differ. I had a chance to attend two military academies. I turned it down, and am glad I did. I don't have to toe the line for this corrupt administration, or suffer from the cognitive dissonance with which I have seen many in uniform struggle. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: keto (with edits) EMAIL: IP: 15.251.169.70 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 03:22:26 PM Are you kidding me? Drop the motherhood and apple pie. The events of the last 7 years have effectively negated your paragraph. It is not noble to fight a rich man's war. To encourage our youth to enlist at this time is simply criminal. We are fighting against neither a nation nor ideas. We are a force occupying a few patches of land in the midst of a multi-party civil war. We have killed and tortured many so that our puppet government can give US-based oil companies legal permission to exploit another people's natural resources. What's so noble about that? Noblest profession? I beg to differ. I had the chances to attend two military academies. I turned them down, and am glad I did. I don't have to toe the line for this corrupt administration, or suffer from the cognitive dissonance with which I have seen many in uniform struggle. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: rikyrah EMAIL: siport27@aol.com IP: 172.131.77.9 URL: DATE: 05/03/2007 03:48:13 PM I respect anyone willing to put their lives on the line, but it doesn't mean that I have to encourage anyone I know to do it. People wonder where the Black community is at the anti-war movement. We are here - against the war, as a community, from the beginning. And, unwilling to give our sons and daughters to go to slaughter for an unjust and immoral war. Plus, we see the treatment of those who did serve when they get home. ----- COMMENT: AUTHOR: E.C. Hopkins EMAIL: IP: 71.220.154.164 URL: http://www.maxambit.com DATE: 05/03/2007 04:32:17 PM keto: You need a sermon. I wish I had more time to polish this comment/sermon up, but this one will have to do for now. The soldier is the noblest profession in this world because there are still nations who would take from other nations against their will. The soldier defends his or her nation from those other nations. We still live in an aggressive world. Even though we live in the most powerful nation, our power would fade away quickly without our military force. You are too smart to make the mistake of thinking we don't need a military force to maintain or increase our quality of life. You are too smart to make the mistake of thinking that our military might doesn’t influence all the wealth-building international trade deals we have been able to “negotiate” with other nations or our global economic eminence. You are too smart to make the mistake of thinking that our supreme military power is not linked to the fact that you can live so opulently on only 40 to 60 hours of labor per week. And, you are too smart to make the mistake of thinking we don't need soldiers to keep our military strong. U.S. Blacks might not have it as good as U.S. Whites when it comes to average wealth, power, or prestige; however, that is an intra-national problem. We still need people who are willing to do more than talk for their country, who are willing to deal with very real actual and possible international problems. The nobility of the soldier’s profession has nothing to do with race or social class my fellow U.S. citizen. Nor does it have anything to do with whether our current wars are just. We make the U.S. soldier’s profession the noblest profession, because the U.S. soldier walks your, my, our political economic talk. What your and my leaders do with our tax dollars and military machine can be unjust; however, those leaders' unjust uses of our military does not make the soldier’s profession less noble. The soldier is still the one who enables you to live the quality of life you enjoy, no matter what type of political economic games we allow our leaders to play using our soldiers’ lives. You should not forget that. And, you should not forget that soldiers don't go to war until the leaders we put in power or allow to stay in power send them. More importantly, you ought not to forget that they won’t come home until more U.S. citizens demand that our leaders bring them home. If you are tax paying U.S. citizen, with the right to vote and the right to protest, my country’s Southwest Asia wars are your wars too. Our military is using our money. If your political representatives support the war and you aren't using your money, votes, and influence to replace those representatives with people who would end the war, some might argue that your inaction speaks louder than your tough talk. I am a veteran. And, I didn’t have a problem with you or my other fellow U.S. citizens when you and they sent me into combat zones. Somebody had to go; that’s what my fellow citizens agreed upon. I figured it might as well be me. And, while I was in the military, I didn’t have a problem with allowing you and other U.S. citizens to do the tough talking while I did the tough walking. Somebody had to back up all our tough talk. I figured it might as well be me. So, I put the uniform on and I wa
